The Credit Crunch

Re: Evolution and economics!

macbandy — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:36:25 GMT

How did we cause the economic misey abroad? Have you seen how these countrys goverments live or what cars they drive and it is not the attitude" im alright jack" take a good look around London or Birmingham and look at the people living on the streets. Lets start by looking after our own first before we take on the world problems. If we keeped our nose out of everyone elses business and took care of our own we wouldn't be in half the mess we are in now.

Re: Evolution and economics!

rosiet2008 — Thu, 03 Jul 2008 15:12:39 GMT

Well a "looks like we'll have to agree to disagree" woud have been nice but hey ho!

Re: Evolution and economics!

raging — Thu, 03 Jul 2008 13:15:01 GMT

I really cant be bothered with this anymore Rosie, you either are not reading the posts or you are just incapable of understanding a rational debate.

Re: Evolution and economics!

rosiet2008 — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 14:41:30 GMT

Next you'll be suggesting the invasion of Iraq was based solely on the US and the UK's bid to spread "freedom" and was nowt to do with oil or getting a McDonald's installed on every street corner in Iraq. Business rules the world not hearts & flowers and sentimentality.

Re: Evolution and economics!

rosiet2008 — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 14:34:39 GMT

The reason I brought gun & knife culture into this is because you said kids in Britain do not carry weapons (like they do in war-torn Africa). My point was they do indeed carry weapons albeit for different reasons (but not entirely different in that they too seem to be waging their own little wars).

And if you think businesses have no interest in developing Africa then it is you who are blinkered and over-sentimentalising the whole issue.

Re: Evolution and economics!

raging — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 14:17:11 GMT

My first reply fell foul of the moderator. Not surprised really because i am angry.

rosie this argument you put forward incoherent and you are off on a tangent again.

Mr and Mrs average, who contribute to charities abroad, are not multi millionaires, they are not political animals, they are not asset stripping conglomerates. They contribute because they care and want to help make a difference.

I have no idea why you bring our gun and knife culture into this, it has nothing whatsoever to do with this debate. This is a gang culture phenomenon and needs specific tactics to deal with it.

Re: Evolution and economics!

rosiet2008 — Mon, 30 Jun 2008 15:59:06 GMT

raging:

It is not about ploughing cash into these countries Rosie, it is about giving them a chance to re-build their country, infrastructure and helping to educate them about how to make the most of their land.

For who's benefit? Theirs or the foreign (i.e. western) businesses that will prosper on that land, using that (cheaper) workforce, selling their luxury items to unsuspecting Africans who never knew they needed such crap? You don't really think this is all being done out of 'goodwill' do you?? It's a business enterprise - nothing more nothing less - a chance to open up even more new markets.

However poor you are you have the state to fall back on, because we live in a country that has a welfare system you will not starve. You will not have to walk for miles to get clean water, your crops are not going to be ravaged by pestilence or your home destroyed by war. Your children will not be forced to carry guns and you will not live in fear of being assaulted or killed.

finally - yes I sincerely beleive that if we wer in that position then other countries would help.

I don't know whether you've noticed but an increasing number of kids in Britain are indeed arming themselves as they seem to be waging their own little wars. And contrary to the myth that Britain is a bottomless pit of money it is not. Your grandchildren or great grandchildren may well have to test your theory - that other (richer countries) would help us out if necessary - in years to come when the health service is no more and Britain has bankrupted itself bending over backwards to "help out" others. This however is unlikely to happen. What is more likely to happen is that Britain becomes more & more divided as the rich get rich and the poor get poorer. We can see it happening already as the health service is being drained of it's resources, doctors are getting choosy as to who to treat and who not to treat and the only winners are those who can afford private treatment (oh and the Africans to whom the drugs are being shipped). Heard the tale about the resistance to drugs? Seems to be just a cost cutting exercise - a way of rationing drugs to British people who have paid all their lives into the health service. So where are all those rationed drugs going I wonder?

Re: Evolution and economics!

raging — Mon, 30 Jun 2008 15:19:47 GMT

It is not about ploughing cash into these countries Rosie, it is about giving them a chance to re-build their country, infrastructure and helping to educate them about how to make the most of their land.

However poor you are you have the state to fall back on, because we live in a country that has a welfare system you will not starve. You will not have to walk for miles to get clean water, your crops are not going to be ravaged by pestilence or your home destroyed by war. Your children will not be forced to carry guns and you will not live in fear of being assaulted or killed.

finally - yes I sincerely beleive that if we wer in that position then other countries would help.

Re: Evolution and economics!

rosiet2008 — Thu, 26 Jun 2008 21:15:45 GMT

btw how much is ploughing money into Africa really about helping Africans anyway? Isn't it more a case of yet another place for businesses to ply their trade?

Re: Evolution and economics!

rosiet2008 — Thu, 26 Jun 2008 21:13:10 GMT

I know we don't have to participate but I'm sick of people haranguing us on this issue. Can't switch on the TV and/or radio or pick up a paper these days without hearing or seeing the words fair trade. What about a fair price for our own (British) workers?

Re: Evolution and economics!

mjames2 — Thu, 26 Jun 2008 21:04:29 GMT

Rosie, Charities appeal for your kindness, they don't force you to give money, there are plenty of UK charities you can give to. The people in Africa you rile about have not taken our manufacturing jobs, Fair trade is just an effort to help farmers in developing countries get a fair price for their produce, again you dont have to perticipate.

Re: Evolution and economics!

rosiet2008 — Wed, 25 Jun 2008 21:03:58 GMT

Or maybe you just have to be on a damn good earner to give a toss about how badly off other people are. Alright for the likes of Geldof and Bono to spout about how we should all be giving our money away given the position they're in. They've got plenty. If they care so much let them make themselves bankrupt in their sanctimonious cause - I've got bills to pay and food to buy.

Re: Evolution and economics!

rosiet2008 — Wed, 25 Jun 2008 20:56:30 GMT

I think the government of this country, elected by people of this country should concentrate on helping the homeless, the unemployed, the pensioners, the less well off in this country. Who died and made them the guardians of the entire world. And just out of curiosity do you think any other country would be so eager to help us if/when we become a third world nation (as we will no doubt become judging by their current practice of consideration for every other nationality but British).

Re: Evolution and economics!

raging — Wed, 25 Jun 2008 17:22:01 GMT

EH??????

Scroungers from Africa is it? So starving babies and a barren landscape, war torn destruction and drought, this is scrounging?

Where does collective responsibility begin and end? Are you advocating the "i'm alright jack" attitude? charity begins at home, fair enough, but what about when it was the country of your birth that has caused economic misery abroad in the first place?

Re: Evolution and economics!

rosiet2008 — Thu, 19 Jun 2008 14:51:43 GMT

And yet still we're harangued to keep pouring money into Africa and to buy "fair trade" and yet those who advocate fair trade couldn't give a stuff if people in this country aren't paid a fair wage - their mantra in such instances is "it's up to the individual to 'better themselves'" so why don't we just leave the scroungers from abroad to do likewise (particularly now that we're facing our own economic crisis).