I must admit I am one of the many fans who have returned to this sport after years of predictable results. It has been a massive criticism of the sport for years and each time there have been promises to do away with the unpredictability and make the sport exciting again like it was back in the day. Since 2005 there have been very small changes to make this happen again but it is only this year that F1 has really provided a true unpredictable sport. Don't shout Brawn either because everyone knows red bull are just about in sync with them now which was no where near the case in Monaco. Brawn don't act like a team relaxing as the season goes on no matter how much of a lead they have and this is good this is unpredictable. No one can realistically say they have it in the bag at this stage and the point is if this was July 2004 everyone would know who was going to win.

I have watched all the press updates from Ferrari as this year has progressed and I agree with Eddie Jordan they are acting like a team that has been used to buying their way out of trouble in the past and they simply are not used to being in a situation where money cannot buy them a championship. They simply do not know what to do with themselves and throwing their weight around about the rule changes is the best thing they could come up with. They speak of their brand and everything the Ferrari means which basically boasts "a reputation to uphold on the road and on the track". All that we are seeing is ego, jealousy, desperation and disbelief.

When Ferrari started the whole idea of boycotting 2010 they were the only team doing so for a short time and when the other jumped on the band wagon they said they wanted to race with the best drivers and the best teams - excluded force India no doubt and the idea of new teams that would add more unpredictability to the sport. These new teams that were to enter the 2010 grid were not in so many words described as a joke by Ferrari and that just goes to show this school yard bully aspect to their quest to regain dominance on the sport - something they consider their right simply because they are Ferrari.

They just don't to be associated as losers or non competitive because they feel it will tarnish their whole image off the track too and that would be a disaster for them. They need new rich people to buy their road cars which have a reputation influenced by their performance as winners in F1. If they don't win and then have their most uncompetitive season in years don't you think it's expected that they would try someway to steel control over the sport. The whole FOTA breakaway idea is clearly an idea sparked by Ferrari or at least pushed more than any other team because they need to suit the rules to make it easier for them to win. Remember the FOTA organisation is not a 3rd part regulator as it is run by the teams and this would be like watching a football match where both managers to take position as ref.

That will not work as a sport and if anything would just be a show for Ferrari, Renault and McLaren to take it in turns to uphold their reputation. Notice I only mention manufactures because the others rely on them without their own supply chains. I feel the FOTA thing is just one great big manufacturer mafia trying to bring the sport back into repetition because for them repartition on the track means more sales on the road. Trust the FIA or an alternative 3rd party regulator if you like F1 to remain a proper sport I say.

If you are a die hard supporter of the breakaway farce I say good luck to you because who will fund that show? who will regulate the rules? how will they alone afford to run a non budget capped tour in a world recession?

"All that we are seeing is ego, jealousy, desperation and disbelief."

I agree wholeheartedly, perhaps you should just stop posting it Max  .

 "something they consider their right simply because they are Ferrari."

 Proof for that ? Or is it just your opinion and supposition ?.

"The whole FOTA breakaway idea is clearly an idea sparked by Ferrari or at least pushed more than any other team because they need to suit the rules to make it easier for them to win. Remember the FOTA organisation is not a 3rd part regulator "

It doesn't matter who "sparked the idea", the simple fact is that 7 other teams, out of a total of 10 agreed with their stance.

Fota indeed isn't a 3rd part regulator, nor does it seek to be, unless of course you have evidence to the contrary ?.

"because for them repartition on the track means more sales on the road"

Repartition ?

"If you are a die hard supporter of the breakaway farce I say good luck to you because who will fund that show? who will regulate the rules? how will they alone afford to run a non budget capped tour in a world recession?"

Thank you for your good wishes, should a breakaway occur I believe the teams,  backed by their parent companies and sponsors will fund it. Where have they said that if they started a breakaway series it would be uncapped ? I must have missed that.

stigga:

"All that we are seeing is ego, jealousy, desperation and disbelief."

I agree wholeheartedly, perhaps you should just stop posting it Max  .

 

 

You saw right through that one didnt you LOL 

Welcome to the forum. I fear you may ruffle a few feathers with that. Words like light and blue touch-paper spring immediately to mind. Forgive me if I just stand back a little!

Welcome to the forum......................Youv'e now learnt the house rules

No posts questioning the validity of Ferrari to win everything

No posts questioning the validity of FOTA's status as demi gods

Good luck with your next post........................are you sure your not Max?

stigga:

"All that we are seeing is ego, jealousy, desperation and disbelief."

I agree wholeheartedly, perhaps you should just stop posting it Max  .

 

 "something they consider their right simply because they are Ferrari."

 Proof for that ? Or is it just your opinion and supposition ?.

 

"The whole FOTA breakaway idea is clearly an idea sparked by Ferrari or at least pushed more than any other team because they need to suit the rules to make it easier for them to win. Remember the FOTA organisation is not a 3rd part regulator "

It doesn't matter who "sparked the idea", the simple fact is that 7 other teams, out of a total of 10 agreed with their stance.

Fota indeed isn't a 3rd part regulator, nor does it seek to be, unless of course you have evidence to the contrary ?.

 

"because for them repartition on the track means more sales on the road"

Repartition ?

 

 

"If you are a die hard supporter of the breakaway farce I say good luck to you because who will fund that show? who will regulate the rules? how will they alone afford to run a non budget capped tour in a world recession?"

Thank you for your good wishes, should a breakaway occur I believe the teams,  backed by their parent companies and sponsors will fund it. Where have they said that if they started a breakaway series it would be uncapped ? I must have missed that.

 

 

You don't really need proof for everything. If someone predicted something, it may happend or may not! It doesn't need proof. If people keep asking for proof, then for isntance many many articles on internet will have to be withdrawn, because there proving will be difficult. I am not justifying making false allegation. There is limit to everything. 

Last time I made a statement about "Costworth's lack of performance" (I refered to both performance and reliability), you told me to prove it. I couldn't at the time, but just by coincedence, I saw an article on F1-live (29-6-09) and remarks made by Patrick Head regarding coswroth and one of the problem with their engine. It is worth a look. 

The comment made by the original postee, about teams refereeing themselves is a valid point. Ferrari leading or managing the FOTA won't make it an independant series anymore. How can anyone honestly claim that the series is fair and not pre arranged??

You say they may have budget cap, how can anyone be sure that these teams will stick to rules???? Historyically (dispite the fact that you disagree with me on this), F1 teams have proved what they are capable of, and how trust worthy they are. Their cars are still subject to scrutineering. For example, after each race their fuel is sent for analysis, because they still don't trust each other (remember fuel issue in last race of 2007).  

There is so much to organising a season that, it is way beyond the ability of these teams (don't ask me for proof), just look at Donnigton, Silverstone and how messy it has been to get the just one track organised?

The other point is, FIA tried to get teams to sign a 5 year agreement in return for having "no limited budget", but teams refused that.  No one even recognised the fact that FIA were trying their hardest to get the F1 guaranteed for the next 5 years! 

It is easy for FOTA to make claims, all at the time they are not even sure about their short term future. 

MAX? omg what a bunch of conspiracy theorists lol. Maybe they should rename this forum to the ferrari board to support the brake away farrari F1

No posts questioning the validity of farrari to win everything?

No posts questioning the validity of FOTA's status as demi gods?

Nice censorship idea there pal................................sure your not Luca di Montezemolo

I recommend you read the original post most clearly because I do not support the FIA I support a regulator full stop whoever that may be. Fact is Ferrari is not a regulator and cannot dictate a series simply to run in their favor. Thats not a sport thats a showroom promotion. and you know it dom.....oops sorry redfrog

mo1965:

You don't really need proof for everything. If someone predicted something, it may happend or may not! It doesn't need proof. If people keep asking for proof, then for isntance many many articles on internet will have to be withdrawn, because there proving will be difficult. I am not justifying making false allegation. There is limit to everything. 

Last time I made a statement about "Costworth's lack of performance" (I refered to both performance and reliability), you told me to prove it. I couldn't at the time, but just by coincedence, I saw an article on F1-live (29-6-09) and remarks made by Patrick Head regarding coswroth and one of the problem with their engine. It is worth a look. 

The comment made by the original postee, about teams refereeing themselves is a valid point. Ferrari leading or managing the FOTA won't make it an independant series anymore. How can anyone honestly claim that the series is fair and not pre arranged??

You say they may have budget cap, how can anyone be sure that these teams will stick to rules???? Historyically (dispite the fact that you disagree with me on this), F1 teams have proved what they are capable of, and how trust worthy they are. Their cars are still subject to scrutineering. For example, after each race their fuel is sent for analysis, because they still don't trust each other (remember fuel issue in last race of 2007).  

There is so much to organising a season that, it is way beyond the ability of these teams (don't ask me for proof), just look at Donnigton, Silverstone and how messy it has been to get the just one track organised?

The other point is, FIA tried to get teams to sign a 5 year agreement in return for having "no limited budget", but teams refused that.  No one even recognised the fact that FIA were trying their hardest to get the F1 guaranteed for the next 5 years! 

It is easy for FOTA to make claims, all at the time they are not even sure about their short term future. 

No Mo, of course you dont "need" proof for everything, but when you're trying to gauge whether a poster who's comments you've read is informed, or just prone to making innacurate statements it helps if that proof is there.

For instance the McLaren legal appearance where you unequivocably stated that McLaren were represented by "a company solicitor", it was helpful to me (and possibly others) that I was able to show that McLaren were represented by no less than one of the countrys top QC's, and 4 other legal advisors, quite a difference Mo, and as I say, these things all help to show whether someone is reliably informed, or not.

"The comment made by the original postee, about teams refereeing themselves is a valid point. Ferrari leading or managing the FOTA won't make it an independant series anymore. How can anyone honestly claim that the series is fair and not pre arranged?"

As easily as someone can claim that Ferrari would be "managing the FOTA" But the evidence so far suggests that they are a democratic organisation, with a chairman that serves for one term of one year.

"You say they may have budget cap, how can anyone be sure that these teams will stick to rules???? Historyically (dispite the fact that you disagree with me on this), F1 teams have proved what they are capable of, and how trust worthy they are. Their cars are still subject to scrutineering. For example, after each race their fuel is sent for analysis, because they still don't trust each other (remember fuel issue in last race of 2007)."

The FIA dicatate that the fuel is tested, not the teams.

There is so much to organising a season that, it is way beyond the ability of these teams (don't ask me for proof), just look at Donnigton, Silverstone and how messy it has been to get the just one track organised?

Going off on a tangent again Mo ? a circuit owner/promoter organising one circuit is so different to 8 or more teams organising a whole series, you're trying to compare apples with oranges.

"The other point is, FIA tried to get teams to sign a 5 year agreement in return for having "no limited budget", but teams refused that.  No one even recognised the fact that FIA were trying their hardest to get the F1 guaranteed for the next 5 years!"

Max has repeatedly told us he's scared of a manufacturer leaving, the teams have constantly (despite all the rumours about Toyota and Renault) stated their willingness to commit, but without the FIA having carte blanche over what they spend and the ability to examine the books of huge corporations, I dont blame them one iota for not wanting to sign up, incidentally, did you forget that Max wanted them to "sign first and then sort out the details" ?.

"It is easy for FOTA to make claims, all at the time they are not even sure about their short term future."

There you go again Mo, how exactly do you how sure they are of their short term future ?.

violator101:

MAX? omg what a bunch of conspiracy theorists lol. Maybe they should rename this forum to the ferrari board to support the brake away farrari F1

 

No posts questioning the validity of farrari to win everything?

 

No posts questioning the validity of FOTA's status as demi gods?

 

Nice censorship idea there pal................................sure your not Luca di Montezemolo

Welcome to the forum btw, you might find (assuming you plan to stay at least until October)  that its helpful to use the quote button, at least then we'll know who you're addresing your comments to. or at least use the posters name.

In respect of the rules, take no notice of anyone who actually posts on here, you're as free to air your views as the next man, or woman, as the case may be, the mods will stop you posting anything that contravenes the rules.

violator101:

I recommend you read the original post most clearly because I do not support the FIA I support a regulator full stop whoever that may be. Fact is Ferrari is not a regulator and cannot dictate a series simply to run in their favor. Thats not a sport thats a showroom promotion. and you know it dom.....oops sorry redfrog

I think you took my post the wrong way LOL . I am neither a Ferrari or FOTA fanboy , and do my best to let everyone know.........read some of my posts

As so many have previously pointed out, sarcasm just does't work on the internet

violator101:

I recommend you read the original post most clearly because I do not support the FIA I support a regulator full stop whoever that may be. Fact is Ferrari is not a regulator and cannot dictate a series simply to run in their favor. Thats not a sport thats a showroom promotion. and you know it dom.....oops sorry redfrog

Good to see your judgement isn't totally flawed though

redfrog:

violator101:

I recommend you read the original post most clearly because I do not support the FIA I support a regulator full stop whoever that may be. Fact is Ferrari is not a regulator and cannot dictate a series simply to run in their favor. Thats not a sport thats a showroom promotion. and you know it dom.....oops sorry redfrog

I think you took my post the wrong way LOL . I am neither a Ferrari or FOTA fanboy , and do my best to let everyone know.........read some of my posts

As so many have previously pointed out, sarcasm just does't work on the internet

 

 

 

yeah neither does hipocracy. that was a poor bit of sarcasm to say "sure your not max" simple because someone does not like the idea of an unregulated series. The fact is frog you tried to unmined my original post with that remark and totally missed that fact that I do not support FIA but if I had a choice of who upholds the rules in the sport the a 3rd party regulator is more logical than letting the teams do their own rules.

stigga:

 

No Mo, of course you dont "need" proof for everything, but when you're trying to gauge whether a poster who's comments you've read is informed, or just prone to making innacurate statements it helps if that proof is there.

For instance the McLaren legal appearance where you unequivocably stated that McLaren were represented by "a company solicitor", it was helpful to me (and possibly others) that I was able to show that McLaren were represented by no less than one of the countrys top QC's, and 4 other legal advisors, quite a difference Mo, and as I say, these things all help to show whether someone is reliably informed, or not.

 

 

"The comment made by the original postee, about teams refereeing themselves is a valid point. Ferrari leading or managing the FOTA won't make it an independant series anymore. How can anyone honestly claim that the series is fair and not pre arranged?"

As easily as someone can claim that Ferrari would be "managing the FOTA" But the evidence so far suggests that they are a democratic organisation, with a chairman that serves for one term of one year.

 

"You say they may have budget cap, how can anyone be sure that these teams will stick to rules???? Historyically (dispite the fact that you disagree with me on this), F1 teams have proved what they are capable of, and how trust worthy they are. Their cars are still subject to scrutineering. For example, after each race their fuel is sent for analysis, because they still don't trust each other (remember fuel issue in last race of 2007)."

The FIA dicatate that the fuel is tested, not the teams.

 

There is so much to organising a season that, it is way beyond the ability of these teams (don't ask me for proof), just look at Donnigton, Silverstone and how messy it has been to get the just one track organised?

Going off on a tangent again Mo ? a circuit owner/promoter organising one circuit is so different to 8 or more teams organising a whole series, you're trying to compare apples with oranges.

 

 

 

"The other point is, FIA tried to get teams to sign a 5 year agreement in return for having "no limited budget", but teams refused that.  No one even recognised the fact that FIA were trying their hardest to get the F1 guaranteed for the next 5 years!"

 

Max has repeatedly told us he's scared of a manufacturer leaving, the teams have constantly (despite all the rumours about Toyota and Renault) stated their willingness to commit, but without the FIA having carte blanche over what they spend and the ability to examine the books of huge corporations, I dont blame them one iota for not wanting to sign up, incidentally, did you forget that Max wanted them to "sign first and then sort out the details" ?.

"It is easy for FOTA to make claims, all at the time they are not even sure about their short term future."

There you go again Mo, how exactly do you how sure they are of their short term future ?.

So you think 8 teams start organising circuits and market F1 internationally.

You think FIA lays the rules for inspecting F1 cars after each race? Have you ever thought about how Mclaren new about fuel temperature in williams car???? There you go again, is this another assumption you are making similar to your statement on Costworth engines?????? 

Do you think if FOTA were capable of running a series, they wouldn't do that????

Do you know how much money is involved in F1 (think about it), and you really think these teams would refuse to take it, if they were capable of doing it??? 

The problem is, you have made up your mind on FOTA and everything they say has become de-facto (good for you).  I just wait for you to come back and say "prove it"???????????????????????? 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

I extracted the following from ITV's website:

On FOTA's side it was Mosley's agreement not to stand again and the return of the F1 Commission for setting new rules. 

------------------------------------------------------------------- 

violator101:

redfrog:

violator101:

I recommend you read the original post most clearly because I do not support the FIA I support a regulator full stop whoever that may be. Fact is Ferrari is not a regulator and cannot dictate a series simply to run in their favor. Thats not a sport thats a showroom promotion. and you know it dom.....oops sorry redfrog

I think you took my post the wrong way LOL . I am neither a Ferrari or FOTA fanboy , and do my best to let everyone know.........read some of my posts

As so many have previously pointed out, sarcasm just does't work on the internet

 

 

 

 

yeah neither does hipocracy. that was a poor bit of sarcasm to say "sure your not max" simple because someone does not like the idea of an unregulated series. The fact is frog you tried to unmined my original post with that remark and totally missed that fact that I do not support FIA but if I had a choice of who upholds the rules in the sport the a 3rd party regulator is more logical than letting the teams do their own rules.

I think the big     after "sure your not max"  was pretty clear it was meant in jest